Wearing Of Safety Gear(Lack Of)

[Lansdown Boy]

I am becoming increasingly amazed at the amount of us landboarders who do not wear even a helmet when out and ripping on the boards.

Does it take injury down-time for us to realise how dangerous this sport can be.

Anyone who tries to jump without wearing a helmet, probably doesn't have anything in the head to effect.

I was at Saunton Sands for 5 days over last weekend and i was the only kitelandboarder there with helmet and pads on out of the many i observed.

Those of us who have been into the sport for a while should be setting an example to the many newcomers into the sport by the donning of safety equipment.

[Hyadanakite]

The young no fear the stupid as well.

[Pugsleythefirst]

I agree completely - it took 5 stitches and a nice scar down my face to make me realise that a wearing helmet is the way forward. You could get cheap full face lids from Halfords in the Summer so no excuses!

 

I like you am amazed by the amount of people that dont wear them - they must be crackers!

[Henry Primett]

it deppends wat u cal a lack of protection. i wear elbow pads and a helmat. yet i am supprised about how many boarders dont even wear a helmat.

[Mr Jo Macdonald]

Hmm I dunno, I think safety is a pretty personal choice, so each to his/her own.

This is the way I see it.

I don't wear a helmet on the water because I don't like the idea of the water or sand being able to get more of a purchase on my head if I get dragged and twist my head around the wrong way. I also think a helmet will protect you from minor knocks but not make much difference really in a major impact because if you get dragged fast enough head first into something big, heavy and imoveable you'll probably break your neck anyway, I have started wearing an impact vest since I started going out when it's nukin.

For me the most important thing is to stay away from obstacles downwind.

I think it has a lot to do with where you're kiting, I've only kited on water really so far, on snow I will use a helmet because of ice and small rocks, I can also see a helmet beign a real good idea if you're offroad (with trees and rocks around) or on tarmac but on a big empty beach there's only really packed sand, no rocks around, won't even packed sand cushion a blow pretty much anyway? I can imaging knocking my head on packed sand giving me a nice concusion stylee wack but nothing like hitting it on rocks or against a concrete wall?? Anyone who has hit their bonce on packed sand and got off worse please correct me.

I think it also depends on what sort of conditiions you're kiting in, I'm really only into kiting with a landboard in lightwind, in 10knots or more I'll be on the water so on the beach with a landboard i won't be going that high.

What are the most common serious inuries that could happen jumping on packed sand? I could imagine it being easier to beak a leg or rib than split your head open.

If you're landing most of your jumps on your head I can see a helmet being a good idea, or polishing up yer jumpin technique

[Henry Primett]

i still think u should wear a helmat on land where eva u r because u never know and theres nothin 2 lose. ur more likely 2 survive with a helmat. so it makes sense just 2 wear 1.

[Henry Primett]

u may as well wear a helmat coz u got nutthin 2 lose but ur more likely 2 survive or not get seriously injured

[spooky]

Yes it is about personal choice, but my view is this (as this has cropped up more than once)

1, A helmet may or may not protect you in the event of a seriouse incedent, true. BUT there is still a chance that it will. Not wearing one and it is GARENTEED that it will not protect you.

2, A helmet will help prevent minor injuries, ie lack cuts, bumps and bruises. Ok some of these may not need hospital treatment (though alot will) BUT it will make the difference between hurting yourself to the point where you want to pack up and go home and being able to carry on flying.

3, There is plenty of medical evidence ot there that proves it does not take much of a knock to cause damage to the brain. May not make much difference now, but when you get to the point that your brain is starting to fail (ie older) then you may wise you had saved those extra brain cells when you could?

4, It is all about taking "all reasonable precations". Your insurance may be invalid by not wearing one (even though it does not stat that you must)? We all know how they like to get out of paying up, this could be the excuse they need?

NB That is not a slate at the BBC as they are the body that helps us exsists, but unfortunatly the have to get there insurance from some where, ie Sharks!

5, I think this is the most important one as it is not about individual choice, but about what your actions/inactions coud do to others. The general rule for all kiting is that you must be incontrol of your kite/board/buggy etc at all times. How can you do this if you are unconciouse????? especially as now more and more of use like to fly powered up and with harnesses. It is ok haveing safety devices fitted, but you need to be able to operate them! If some one wipes out the chances of hitting there head is high. So the chance of hitting it hard enough to make you lose control is also high (dose not nesscerily mean KO, justed stunned).

I know that I will be very hacked off if I am effected by someone who falls into that section! Ok we all know accidents happen, and I like others have no probelms with helping those who have them if it is a genuine accident. But if that accident is caused or enhanced by not taking "all resonable precautions" that is adifferent story!! Same applies for those that fly over powered and keep there kites high (all the time!!) or fly in areas that do not offer an approprate safety area down wide just in case that "Freak" accident happens.

Apart from that it is personal choice, so fly safe

Jon

[Mr Jo Macdonald]

Good points guys.

But what are the chances of me hitting my head hard enough on packed sand to get knocked uncounsious in less than 10 knots of wind on a big empty beach?

I've never landed on my head in the water so i can't see it hapening on land, hope not anyway even with a helmet, I've landed on me bum/back quite a few times on the water which I'll try to avoid at all costs on the beach even with an impact vest.

How many people who know how to jump kites have been knocked out hitting packed sand in lightwind?

I definately agree that helmets are a good idea in general (especially on land in strong wind or offroad) but for me where you are is much more important than what you're wearing.

I just see many other pretty much helmetless sports being so much more dangerous for head injuries than kiting on a big empty beach, snowboarding for example, pretty easy to hit your head on something hard there (ice or a tree) but not many of us wear a helmet to snowboard, I would kitesnowboarding.

 

Why do I need a helmet riding on packed sand in less than 10 knots on a big empty beach just pulling straight jumps, no deadmen or infinite rotations or **** like that, I'll do that in the water?

I'm personally more concerned with my legs, ankles, wrists, ribs and spinal column, which i can see getting seriously screwed if I land on any of them hard enough and also being much more probable to get landed on and broken than my head.

How many of you guys have had bad knocks on your heads from packed sand?

Nearly all the really bad accidents I've heard about involving traction kites have been bad because the kiter was too close to obstacles downwind and got wasted by these, concrete walls, wavebreakers, rocks, poles etc, not packed sand.

Personally I think it's much more probable I'll get hurt bad driving to the beach than landboarding once I get there without a helmet.

 

Feel free to convince me I'm wrong of course

[FlyingManxMan]

Mate, let's put an end to this nonsense.

Make your own choice.

If you have enough common sense, you will know when to wear a lid.

If u don't (have enough common sense) then please stop kiting!

Think.

Packed sand may not split your nut but what if you get dumped in mid air and fall stupidly onto your own board with your nut hitting the board!

If ur not doing air but just sailing up an down the beach, u probably don't need a lid but it doesn't hurt to wear one does it just incase.

And then u don't know what's lurking just beneath the surface of packed sand do you? Go down the beach one day and there's rocks everywhere, go the next and they're gone but are they? Sand covers rocks too and if your unlucky (which sod's law usually takes care of) you might just fall on a bit of sand that has a nice rock just cm's underneath!

The wind can do strange things too, afterall it is a body of it's own. Look at the kitesurfer that got thrown onto his own house roof the other day! he was about 4 foot in the air doing a trick and a sudden gust just hurled him way into the air, over some trees and dumped him on his own beach house roof!

It's probably rare but it can happen!

know yourself, and when u think u should wear a lid - do it.

And most of all, if u crack ur nut cause u didn't wear a lid, don't come crying here!

P.s. page 100 in the latest kitesurf magazine has a good article explaining just why u should keep ur hat on!

[spooky]

Hi Jo,

Yes your opinons are dead right, in those conditions is there a need for a helmet? May be not it all, comes down to a risk assesment? I Always ride with a helmet as I feel that I need one. Though I did ride with ut the other day as I lost it and did not know till I got to the field. So risk assed it, low winds no one about to effect so yes I did, no worries.

How many people who know how to jump kites have been knocked out hitting packed sand in lightwind?

Again risk assesmnt, not really going to be jumping much in ligtwind in teh first place?

How many of you guys have had bad knocks on your heads from packed sand?

Me for one Remember hard packed sand can be as hard a concreat! As when you hit it it compresses and at some point it will stop compressing, so it will be as hard. Just a case of whether your head has stopped being piled ito it before that point is reached

NB All good helmets should protect by two methods, shock absorbtion ie layers of padding and force/shock dispertion, ie the construction spreads the force via the outer shell and the layers of padding (normally dual density foam) so that there is less impact on a small area hence less damge.

what are the chances

Ok the chances of something happening may be low, but what you have to take into account is the repercutions of that chance happening? Example, Air Travel is the safest form of transport, fact. Repercutions though of that 1 in a million chance of a crash (not sure what the actuall odds are) is very seriouse!!! Fact!

So why risk it?

NB To all, don't get confused about Risk assesments, it is not base on just the "chance" of something happening but what will happen if that chance come up? Big difference.

Nearly all the really bad accidents I've heard about involving traction kites have been bad because the kiter was too close to obstacles downwind and got wasted by these, concrete walls, wavebreakers, rocks, poles etc, not packed sand.

Again true, but why are we only trying to avoid the really bad accidents?

Have fun and fly safe all.

Jon

[Mr Jo Macdonald]

Manxman, I don't think wearing a helmet or not wearing one is nonsense and there's no need for you to get yer knickers in a twist, but just saying it might help if i ever hit my head on the beach isn't convincing imo.

A few people saying they had been riding around in lightwind, few low jumps, having a fun time until they hit their head and got knocked out would sound convincing, or even a few guys saying they've hit their heads hard enough with helmets on to make them worthwhile, tell me about it, I'm willing to learn as are many others I'm sure.

The way I see it now lightwind kiting is just not that dangerous, wearing a helmet while driving a car because i will probably have an accident sooner or later and I'll be better off with a helmet sounds much more sensible but no-one does it, cars are way more dangerous than traction kites.

Also i don't think you can seriously compare someone getting lofted into their house with trundling around a big empty beach in less than 10 knots popping a few low jumps. Kiting too close to obstacles (houses, trees or whatever) downwind in strong, gusty and probably onshore winds while flying the kite high is what's gonna kill ya, not mucking around on the beach in lightwind without a lid on. Why? because you're kiting too close to obstacles downwind, not because you were or weren't wearing a lid.

 

Imo it's not what safety gear or systems we're using or not using that make this sport dangerous or not, it's where we're kiting and in what conditions.

 

Would you launch a well-powered traction kite on a narrow beach? Maybe you would if you were wearing a helmet to protect your head, feel safe, go for it, maybe not though, I dunno. Many people do though with and without helmets, that's an accident waiting to happen imo, not farting around on a big beach in lightwind.

 

I've been in a serious impact accident, 180 km/h full frontal, and I was wearing a helmet but it wasn't the helmet that saved me or put me in a coma or made any difference to how much I got ****ed up so bad it's taken me three years to get over it, if the **** hits the fan big time it's really just a question of luck.

I was riding a bike on the road and that's where you need a helmet imo, because yes it might make a difference on the road if you hit something hard, but not on sand in lightwind, imo.

 

Let's hear a few guys telling of their knocks to the head on sand in lightwind, how bad was it, were you glad you had a lid on, did you wish you had a lid on?

Like, "I was just trundling around in 8 knots, popped a low jump, fluffed it and slapped my head on the beach so hard it gave me double vision for 2 weeks, that's a good case for wearing a lid imo." Tell me about it.

That would be convincing.

Just calling people idiots because they don't wear helmets is as lame as calling people soft for wearing them, it's just hot air.

A lot of if-this and if-thats is not convincing, if I didn't accept the risk of getting run over by a bus because it might happen one day I wouldn't ever get outtathe house, or like I might but with a lid on, ya never know.

Let the lidless horror stories roll and I will start wearing a lid.

Jo

;-)

[Mr Jo Macdonald]

Hi Jon,

Nice one, now we're getting somwhere.

 

re: Me for one

Does that mean you used to ride on the beach without a helmet and started wearing one after getting wacked on the noggin so hard it hurt??

If so, would you be up for telling us about it. Like what were the conditions and place like, rider experience, equipment, what happened, where did you screw up, how much did it hurt, the works you know? Tell me about it, I have me old bike helmet just waiting for an excuse to get worn in the garage.

Also if you've had the same sort of impact with a lid on, what wasthe difference?

This sort of info will seriouslly put the case for wearing a lid to protect yer bonce, not because it might be safer wearing helmet if yer plane crashes

;-)

Jo

[rasga]

4, It is all about taking "all reasonable precations". Your insurance may be invalid by not wearing one (even though it does not stat that you must)? We all know how they like to get out of paying up, this could be the excuse they need?

NB That is not a slate at the BBC as they are the body that helps us exsists, but unfortunatly the have to get there insurance from some where, ie Sharks!

 

Remember though that we are talking about 3rd party liability, so are you telling me that by not having a helmet on it makes you more likely to damage/hit something?

 

It is a point mell has made before, helmets are not a requirement as you are not claiming that you injured yourself and that with one you would be okay (as its bleeding 3rd party)

 

Make sense, and in the instance of member to member accident, i dont think it would affects someone claim (who was say PKSF member) if someone hits them with kite they fall off and hurt their head, it is not their fault as they were not wearing a helmet

 

By the way i do wear a helmet --> even since i got one, before you drag photos up!

 

I have powered up into sand (after a hard->soft sand area) and left a big impact of my head on, nice bowl shape in the sand, it hurt i had helet on still glad i had a helmet on . .and i did fly a bit, i.e rotated and then headplanted, and i wasnt even jumping!

[Pugsleythefirst]

The impact of me hitting the sand face first at speed split my face wide open - yeah I did sustain other injusries, but had I been wearing my Gath lid(Sea) or full face(Land) I would not be left with a 3 inch action man scar down my face now!

 

I learned my lesson and as far as Im concerned there is not debate - Dont wear one at your own risk - END OF

[bladeII4.9]

Originally posted by Mr Jo Macdonald

Hmm I dunno, I think safety is a pretty personal choice, so each to his/her own.

This is the way I see it.

I don't wear a helmet on the water because I don't like the idea of the water or sand being able to get more of a purchase on my head if I get dragged and twist my head around the wrong way. I also think a helmet will protect you from minor knocks but not make much difference really in a major impact because if you get dragged fast enough head first into something big, heavy and imoveable you'll probably break your neck anyway, I have started wearing an impact vest since I started going out when it's nukin.

For me the most important thing is to stay away from obstacles downwind.

I think it has a lot to do with where you're kiting, I've only kited on water really so far, on snow I will use a helmet because of ice and small rocks, I can also see a helmet beign a real good idea if you're offroad (with trees and rocks around) or on tarmac but on a big empty beach there's only really packed sand, no rocks around, won't even packed sand cushion a blow pretty much anyway? I can imaging knocking my head on packed sand giving me a nice concusion stylee wack but nothing like hitting it on rocks or against a concrete wall?? Anyone who has hit their bonce on packed sand and got off worse please correct me.

I think it also depends on what sort of conditiions you're kiting in, I'm really only into kiting with a landboard in lightwind, in 10knots or more I'll be on the water so on the beach with a landboard i won't be going that high.

What are the most common serious inuries that could happen jumping on packed sand? I could imagine it being easier to beak a leg or rib than split your head open.

If you're landing most of your jumps on your head I can see a helmet being a good idea, or polishing up yer jumpin technique

 

 

i've hurt myself on sand, well, on the only pebble on the beach, that knocked me out. wear a lid!

[spooky]

Remember though that we are talking about 3rd party liability, so are you telling me that by not having a helmet on it makes you more likely to damage/hit something?

I agree it is not more likely to make you hit/damage something.

Though if you start to look at something, (which you could be more likely to do if not wareing a helmet as you will be thinking about the concequences more) it is garrenteed under Murphy's law that you will hit it He He

My original point though is that insurance companies ALWAYS try to avoid paying up, and if the beleive that by you not wareing a helmet could have played apart in causeing or being unable to avoid the incedent they will do so! ie Knocked out and let your kite go across a road casueing an accident.

Also note I did use the word "may" invalidate but a bit late to find out you are not covered after the accident, especially for the third party that may now be seriousley out of pocket etc?

Besides that reason is only 1 out of the 5, so majority rule stillsays wear one

Also my reason for thinking that we should all wear one is not just because of things like cuts/bruises etc, but also as stated beforea good helmet will help dissperse the enegy involoved, thus avoiding brain damage, not all injuries are visble?

Glad to hear you where one Rasga

 

Why is it some people that they are more "extreme" when doing things because they are not wearing protection? Yes not wearing a lid will increase the risk of injuries, but it dose not make what you are doing harder to do, just means you have no margin for error?

Just fly safe, Jon

[rjw]

interesting stuff guys.

 

i reckon people have a right to chose until the point when their choice impacts upon somebody else, i.e kiters not wearing protection leading to people who do where it getting banned.

 

it never really occurred to me to where a helmet (its only kite flying afterall) until i read a few threads on here and started boarding at higher speeds, then i though, sod it, does no harm. so now i wear one.

 

i usuallt board on a big open beach sand is bloody hard at 25mph and the hardest thing on the beach is your deck, and in my case that is only 5'10" from my head. thats pretty close.

 

if you choose not to wear a helmet, do you also choose not to wear kite killers.

 

my thoughts

 

rjw

[The_Fat_Man]

1 Helmets keep your hed warm

2 Keep sand out of ears when being dragged along

3 Sandy beaches still have nice round pebbles which will win in a skull vs pebble contest

4 If getting a bollocking for being somewhere where you should not be, make you remarkably deaf.

 

I think knee pads are useful, because it hurts when you land on them. I know this because mine always slip down.

 

TFM

[boode]

The first time I wore my helmet was at the x zone games at westward ho - it was compulsery - big flat hard sand beach - no obstacles - nice wind.

Doing fine until I hit a patch of soft sand - the board stopped dead and my head hit the sand so hard it left a dent 8 inches deep - it hurt but after a 5mins break I was back boarding again.

Without a lid on I would have probably gone home and wasted a great day.

[schmik1599968584]

I ride in some rough spots.... lots of gravel and sometimes fist sized rocks. Geuss where I usually stack ??? Not the nice grassy sections, in the rough stuff. I have had a few instances where i have bounced or rolled onto my head in the rocky stuff. At those points I am glad to be wearing a helmet... especially when i see deep scrtaches on my lid or hear a thump on the outer shell. None of this would kill you if you wearn't wearing the lid but scary sh1t can happen when you are using big kites or flying in big wind. I want to be able to walk away from all my stacks and be able to keep kiting.

 

schmik

[fatoleboy]

Newbie 6.2M gin Yoz, kitescooter wind 8 to 12 kts Isle of Wight,nothing doing on the water got the scoot out and riding on packed sand getting a wiggle on (going fast) flew the kite back too far popped up (about 8' so I am told) came down on my head unconsious and concussed, can't remember anything about it, how I got there who I was blah blah. That was the last time I rode without a helmet freaked too many people out. including me Getting mashed isn't fun for anyone, least of all the poor suckers who have their day wrecked looking after you, the hospital folk who patch you up and last but not least yourself. Don't BS yourself that you are going to be ok, crashes/accidents come out of the blue and are completely unexpected. That's what an accident is isn't it. Your macho sh*t or reasonable sounding excuses for not wearing at least a helmet don't count for much when you are vegatablized or lying in a hospital bed in traction. Think about it, visit the hospitals and meet some really unfortunate geezers who will say "if only I had...." plenty to ask in the A&E every weekend!

 

It's a free world it's your choice and your life but remember where you will find sympathy, it's between sh*t and sypillis in the dictionary.

 

Harsh but true

 

Nuff said:)

[Mr Jo Macdonald]

Ok, thanks guys, I'm sold, I'll start wearing a helmet, anyone else?

[belblade]

would any of you that moan about saftey pads and Helmets go out on a motor bike and do 35 mph + ?

 

so please get it on you her

[acehigh]

Not many obsticals in the water? nice soft landing? not on the board, just body draging. Nothing to hit the head on?

 

Why wear a helmet?

 

Lets not forget there are other users than you on the water. Ok people can see the great kite in the air or on the water, but with 30 meter lines not everyone will know exactly where you are. SPECIALY IN SURF. Windsurf and surfbord fins can easily plant themselfs in your little bobing head. when other users are coming in on the top of waves and you are down below not forgeting the good old jet bikers...

 

Have seen it done.

 

Wear a Helmet...