JKS Posted March 19, 2009 Report Posted March 19, 2009 I have been wondering about this one for a while ..... What do you reckon is better Which is ballsier/safer Which is easier Which is easier to go faster Which is easier to control What do you preffer .... blah blah blah Once again .... I realize there are a MILLION varibles .. so lets get rid of a few. Ommmmmmmmm .... visualize 1. Nice 15k onshore wind 2. Hard sand 3. No gusts (textbook perfect ) 4. NOT takling about fixed bridle on a bar Pure and simple .... fixed bridle on handles VS de-power on bar A- Power B- Top speed Marty Thanks in advance Quote
lickedysplit_au Posted March 19, 2009 Report Posted March 19, 2009 DON'T YOU HAVE ANYTHING BETTER TO DO MARTY!! Ok ok nice thread mate..... Have to be short and sweet I have a wedding to attend For speed, again I say fixed bridle in any conditions. The power of a fixed bridle is only limited by the balls of the pilot and the wind. None of this "ooohhhhh tooo faaaaasst" and letting the bar out. If correct size of kite for the pilot and conditions is selected then depower isn't needed. Standing still (not moving your kite) you can get a fixed bridle race kite (Ie. Yakuza) to move faster through the air than a depowerable kite, therefore, I am sure you will obtain a higher speed per usable square meter of kite. Sure you can get a higher aspect de-power but it isn't designed with the same purpose as a high aspect race kite (fixed bridle). Safer - De-power but safe doesn't necessarily win races mate lol At full speed I am sure you will find it easier to tap more power from a fixed bridle as you can move it through the window. Move a depower around too much at full speed and you will either get lofted or loose speed. Control - Depower would probably be easy to control as you don't need to move it about as much. Hope this helps your thirst for information Marty Quote
Luke Posted March 20, 2009 Report Posted March 20, 2009 For speed, again I say fixed bridle in any conditions. Fact: Fastest guy in the country (Nigel) on a 6m de-power kite! Fact: Fastest person at Labor Day, de-power Fact: First 3 guys across the line in the race on Sunday at Labor Day de-power Fact: Mayday, believe it was me on a bent up freestyle buggy with a de-power The power of a fixed bridle is only limited by the balls of the pilot and the wind. None of this "ooohhhhh tooo faaaaasst" and letting the bar out. What are you implying, de-power guys don't have balls? It takes balls to send a fixed bridle kite behind you without a saftey or 10M+ of canopy to keep you aloft. That is the second thread on fixed bridals vs depower you have used this term, this aint the mardi gras. If correct size of kite for the pilot and conditions is selected then depower isn't needed. Disagree, same buggy same pilot, same wind. Gust hits fixed bridal, good chance you end up getting pulled downwind and loosing your line. Gust hits de-power, let out bar a few inches, hold line, less speed scrubbed off. "Oh to fast" doubt nigel was thinking that at 98 km/h in fact his was looking for 2km/h, maybe "oh Im screwed as the fixed bridal takes you into the soft sand, buggy cartwheels??" That is my experience with both types of kites, based on speed runs I have done. Safer - De-power but safe doesn't necessarily win races mate lol Examples given above from people on EK. Not sure what is happening overseas maybe fixed bridals are faster.... @ Marty, could you come up with a less controversial thread, next time. ps. respect to all kiters who fly fixed bridal or de-power, wether they have testicles or not, their ability to reproduce should not be a flying issue. Apart from the fact a harness would be more comfortable. Quote
SoutherlyBuster Posted March 20, 2009 Report Posted March 20, 2009 Na, keep the contraversional threads up, this gets us all thinking and is more interesting. Quote
trippnu Posted March 20, 2009 Report Posted March 20, 2009 wether its fixed brible of de-power its all about kiting lol Quote
Luke Posted March 20, 2009 Report Posted March 20, 2009 wether its fixed brible of de-power its all about kiting lol Agreed, just pointing out some facts and the measure of a man is not by the size of his friggen depower, or Mike aka Schmik would be doing kite porn. Its getting to a point we need a separate section for big balls fix bridals & inadequate performance envy de-power flyers just to stop this BS. FYI..... I'd love a set of combats Quote
jdhot Posted March 20, 2009 Report Posted March 20, 2009 FYI..... I'd love a set of combats Well ..... welcome to JD's kite library Luke ...... There may be a Combat or two in there JD Quote
nigel Posted March 20, 2009 Report Posted March 20, 2009 I have been wondering about this one for a while ..... What do you reckon is better Which is ballsier/safer Which is easier Which is easier to go faster Which is easier to control What do you preffer .... blah blah blah Whats better? I fly both! Ballsier??? Don't know, but I don't klang when I walk yet. More titanium needed? Safer? Would have to say de-power due to the safties built in. Easier? Easier to what? Fly, land, pack up? Easier to go fast on? I think you should be asking what's the best kite to make usable power, that will match the wind range, and allow for some gusts, or for it to die a little. Fast speeds are attained in strong winds, often gusty, so will have to say the de-power kites are more forgiving and hence more confidence inspiring. Not to say you can't go fast with a fixed. Easier to control? If you can't control it, I doubt you'd be flying it!! Both are the same. What do I preffer? Well I use both, but for the high speed stuff in mega strong and gusty winds the de-power seems to get the biggest work out. Pure and simple .... fixed bridle on handles VS de-power on bar A- Power B- Top speed Marty Thanks in advance A: both will produce enough power to have you in the air if you pick the correct size, sorry, but it's the same. You might be better off to compare power delivery? B: Well it would seem that I would be using the ARC for the high speed stuff, but it comes down to the pilot. We fly with what we have, and what we are comfortable with. Are we just arguing over the fact that the de-powers are bigger and seem to represent a bigger object to drag through the air and hence slower??? SB where is your aero knowledge!!!! I am sure you can put this little arguement to the techno babble crew and come up with a suitable math formula for us to use. I think it will look much like this: Kite + Pilot + Dangly bits + Buggy + Lots of wind = Speed!! Quote
jdhot Posted March 20, 2009 Report Posted March 20, 2009 I have to say I've only really started getting the speed bug this summer after having the advantage of so many days at 7 Mile Beach and been able to improve my skill 10fold. I've really only started getting the idea that a bigger kite is not always the better choice, has nothing to do with male bits neither, if your overpowered and can't get the power to the ground in a straight line and if your washing it off sideways it's detrimental to your forward speed. Now having made some nice upgrades lately to: 1/. A decent buggy, a Libre full race .. not to knock the PL MKII it was good to learn on this now inspire a false sense of security of been safer, even though I feel I am 2/. Harnessing in to kites, which many of you guys have stated alters the position of pull, generally lower and more central, been able to harness the power better and also purchasing some decent fixed fixed bridles & depowers built for speed and performance. So as a novice into the speed thrills, I've found myself in light winds opting for the fixed bridles and accomplishing some reasonable speeds, in the higher winds though I've always headed for the depowers just for the confidence of knowing that overpowering can be washed of with the bar. I possibly need to have more faith in the ability of a larger buggy. Just recently I brought some of the cheap Razor kites going around, smaller ones so now it will be interesting in the higher winds to actually have a high speed kite suited for the condition and make a comparison. The Crossfire demo kite I found exciting and made my PB max speed with, but on that run I reckon I washed off a few K's because a gust hit and dragged me sideways, whereas with a bar I could have just eased it at a bit and keep going forward, so it goes back to this debated subject. I think this could be debated about forever, but as Nigel said it comes down to all those variables and really your comfort with your gear, if your comfortable, comfortable equals confidence, confidence equals adrenalin, adrenalin equals speed, speed equals "Gonads:rofl:" My 2cents worth from a novice angle. JD Quote
lickedysplit_au Posted March 20, 2009 Report Posted March 20, 2009 Just got home, seems I have upset someone around here but don't have the energy right now and will get back to this after a busy day tommorrow. BUT @ Luke before I go, this thread was apparenty based on ones personal opinion buddy. Did I upset you mate or is my opinion not worthy of your greatness and ability over all??? This is my opinion and no show pony is going to change that. Just keep at PKD mate I am sure they will throw a set at you with enough pics. Night Night all Quote
Luke Posted March 20, 2009 Report Posted March 20, 2009 BUT @ Luke Did I upset you mate or is my opinion not worthy of your greatness and ability over all??? Maybe you should have written this statement after you had had some sleep. I am not going to start appologising to you for my flying neither will I put up with BS statements like that from another flyer! So I am sponsored, get into magazines, pioneer new freestyle moves, I do not walk onto a beach with tickets on myself, I just go for a fly, offer to help others if they want it, lend gear and have a good time. If you suffer from performance envy, don't involve me in it. Try pulling that one liner on Flexiforums........ "We mock what we don't understand." Quote
schmik Posted March 20, 2009 Report Posted March 20, 2009 Wow... talk about unresolved sexual tension! I am just itching to get my big balls out and film/shoot you two big hairy lads going at it. hahahaha. Oh yeah, depower is king! It can be a different story in the water. You can ride with so much power that it would be impossible to handle the kite on land unless it was a depower. Sometimes even then it can be too much. You do an assisted launch and someone holds you down while you get to the waters edge. You slip your feet into the pads, pull the power strap and then shoot off like a rocket. You send that mofo for all she's worth and yank on the bar..... casually you observe the curvature of the earth as you ponder the greatness of god as you float like an angel above all the mere mortals on fixed-bridles...... and so is the word of the schmik! hahahahaha mike Quote
lickedysplit_au Posted March 20, 2009 Report Posted March 20, 2009 Maybe you should have written this statement after you had had some sleep. I am not going to start appologising to you for my flying neither will I put up with BS statements like that from another flyer! So I am sponsored, get into magazines, pioneer new freestyle moves, I do not walk onto a beach with tickets on myself, I just go for a fly, offer to help others if they want it, lend gear and have a good time. If you suffer from performance envy, don't involve me in it. Try pulling that one liner on Flexiforums........ "We mock what we don't understand." Back to the performance envy thing, HOW original!! haven't heard this crap since you upset Appo and the rest of Ozone because you didn't agree with what he said. Or was it Joel when he banned your ass??? I guess you must be right Luke the whole world has performance envy next to you mate beause you are THE MAN and I am not worthy. Pretty sure at some stage you have got it in your head that EVERYONE has performance envy over you Luke. Unfortunately this isn't the case here sorry to rain on your parade. I didn't ask for any appologies mate I was just making a vaild point that this thread WAS about what people "reakon" clearly I have uposet you again. BTW which B/S statement arn't you going to put up with?? Perhaps Mike should bring the camera down mate if u arn't going to put up with terrible things like someones opinion. Think it is all getting to your head abit mate, perhaps you should slow down on the self promotion and come back to earth. "We mock what we don't understand" Ummmmm Take a page out of your own book Luke. Quote
schmik Posted March 20, 2009 Report Posted March 20, 2009 That last post disappeared..... you two got a room didn't ya! where was my invite? mike Quote
sinbad Posted March 20, 2009 Report Posted March 20, 2009 OK how about having a buggy freestyle duel, Schmik can do the movies of troy and luke going for it, that's Moves not aerial fighting and put them up here. We can then do online judging. So how about it guys you up for it ??? Quote
schmik Posted March 20, 2009 Report Posted March 20, 2009 How about a 'frot' sword fight? Look that up on google! mike Quote
.Joel Posted March 20, 2009 Report Posted March 20, 2009 Flying depowers is like adjusting your ball size mid flight.... "shit my balls aren't that big, i'll let the bar out..." Flying fixed bridles is like muscle building for your balls.... "shit I hope my balls can withstand this or they're copping a bruising..." So no, nobody is saying depower kiters don't have balls, it's just common knowledge they give themselves a "rearrange" mid flight Cris Italy has BIG balls, ask his Mrs,they needed a trundle on the other side of the bed at night just to rest them in whilst he's asleep. Regards, .Joel Quote
JKS Posted March 21, 2009 Author Report Posted March 21, 2009 Wow .... moderation !!! I sure didn't expect the fuse to go off in under 2 days I guess balls are a very personal thing and mentioning them was destined to bring trouble ..... Balls are something that bring out the defensive mechanisims very quickly !! When I kite ... I try and keep my balls off my mind.... especially at 80 kmh + Personal experience has lead me towards de-power kite (tubes in particular). I have not had a lot of experience with fixed bridles (hence why I started the thread) and am hoping to squeeze lots of information from the fruit of the kiting nation. Your opinions are great and I sincerely want to hear more, variety, balance, more more more ...... they are especially good for those like myself that have yet to form them. Try not to make it personal .... keep it passionate instead. I am NOT saying anyone else is wrong .... I am just rambling about what if have found right for me (so far) In my little world, I have found the de-power reigns supreme. Although they lack 'off the mark power' (but only a little) this is usualy from my own error rather than the kite .... Take offs involve that sudden 'snap', the fact that the bar can travel in and out brings a hint of 'spongy' to the power and the way its delivered. Letting the bar move during take off costs power ... not having the bar in the right spot costs power. The nature of a de-power means 'the right spot' to hold the bar is a 'fuzzy grey area' so its a feel thing. IMHO A fixed bridle is just that ... fixed, you get used to it, you get it wired.. you get the 'snap' much easier. But but but but but, some (mine included) have a stopperb all ....... If the stopper ball is set .... Instant fixed bridle Once rolling I reckon de-powers kick arse. The ease and smoothness of of getting power from the kite to the buggy ... no argument. De-power all the way, weather it be steady wind or gusty .... the speed builds quickly and is user friendly all the way. As an added bonus, they let you hold your hold your line and stay in control rather than have the gusts determine where you head. A de-power with a lot of throw provides you with sooooooo much user friendly it aint funny. As the speed builds the wind window changes, as the beach curves the sweet spot moves. By giving the kite minor input with the bar position you can adapt so easily to all of this. User friendly. Our best local beach area (Brighton) is a pond dodging nightmare and the next nearest beach (Bribie) is relativly narrow and lined with trees close to the shore ... soooooooo ... we have to contend with 'evasive' action a lot. Once again, de-power reigns supreme. Top end speed .... well ... results speak for themselves. There is soooooooooooo much more to say .... but I wanna hear from you guys, NOT me Marty p.s. I have great respect for kiters with balls .... Quote
Luke Posted March 21, 2009 Report Posted March 21, 2009 This is my opinion and no show pony is going to change that. ............................ you have some serious issues. Quote
sinbad Posted March 21, 2009 Report Posted March 21, 2009 We interrupt this topic to make the following statement. Enough is Enough again this has gone way off off topic its about. " Speed and power - Fixed bridle vs Depower" not who has the biggest balls. Enough do that in PM's to each other. Unless you have a comment re the "topic" STFU Thanks you normal program will now be resumed. Quote
trippnu Posted March 21, 2009 Report Posted March 21, 2009 im a bit of a newbie flow my first depower the other day only a small 4.5 gin i wind was only about 10 to 15 and flying at murraie i found that fixed bridle are a little more on the edge of ur seat exciting if yu like the unpredictable sence more of a adrenaline rush were the depower u were in more control predictable but as i said its only a 4.5 but as it was only my first depower flight will be out for some more reaserch lol experience so far bring spare undies with a fixed bridle lol Simon Quote
lickedysplit_au Posted March 21, 2009 Report Posted March 21, 2009 ............................ you have some serious issues. :rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl: Quote
JKS Posted March 21, 2009 Author Report Posted March 21, 2009 We interrupt this topic to make the following statement. Enough is Enough again this has gone way off off topic its about. " Speed and power - Fixed bridle vs Depower" not who has the biggest balls. Enough do that in PM's to each other. Unless you have a comment re the "topic" STFU Thanks you normal program will now be resumed. Don't make me tell teacher Troy You guys have waaaaaaay to much to offer to go all schoolyard on each other Marty Quote
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