Spangle12 Posted February 20, 2013 Author Report Share Posted February 20, 2013 What I dont understand is why the QR seperates, I ride around without the donkey dick in. If I were to release I would loose the chicken loop.. Dumass design if you ask me... North Iron Heart is the best release I have seen, works with light pressure, full of sand, super easy to reset and offers a sucide setup with safety! True but if you're riding around without the donkey dick in then I assume its because you will be unhooking and if thats the case then you'll be on suicide anyway. I can see your point but looking at the Ironheart system it just looks so over complicated. There's a pin, a pivoting clip, a bungee chord and what is probably a sliding plastic bearing surface for the bit the slides in the release. It just looks like there is so much more to go wrong. But I haven't actually tried it so I don't know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Geoff Posted February 20, 2013 Report Share Posted February 20, 2013 I never understood the whole thing with the two different set up options on Flexi kites. I have Ion2s that can be flown with or without a bridle. Flexi recommends adding the fifth line only when flying without the bridle. I have mine bridled and don't at all fancy the idea of double front line "flag out" so have rebelliously decided to use the fifth line with that setup. Have had to use it in anger once and it didn't cause any trouble at all. As far as I'm concerned the flexi bar is safe enough and, as said, pretty damn easy to reset. Yup, I've heard of plenty of people using that setup, and I've never heard of or thought up a problem with it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bash1599968729 Posted February 20, 2013 Report Share Posted February 20, 2013 try the mutiny bar comes with either a four or 5 line set up and is a very neat and tidy design Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paulie_amoose Posted February 20, 2013 Report Share Posted February 20, 2013 True but if you're riding around without the donkey dick in then I assume its because you will be unhooking and if thats the case then you'll be on suicide anyway. I can see your point but looking at the Ironheart system it just looks so over complicated. There's a pin, a pivoting clip, a bungee chord and what is probably a sliding plastic bearing surface for the bit the slides in the release. It just looks like there is so much more to go wrong. But I haven't actually tried it so I don't know. You have point about riding on suicide but I have a mate who lost his Flexi chicken loop because he was unhooking and had forgotten to stick it on the suicide setup. Why would want to even think about that, you can get an effective QR without it separating, it just seems like old hat. The North system also runs a suicide ring setup so you can have fully safety hooked in and not deploy the safety if you drop bar unhooked. It's a great system. The Iron Heart certainly isn't overly complicated, it's just a plastic cover with a reverse release pin. You can even connect the reride with one hand! I have been running it since 2009 and not had a single issue, releases as good today as it did from new... You should try it, you might like it.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spangle12 Posted February 20, 2013 Author Report Share Posted February 20, 2013 try the mutiny bar comes with either a four or 5 line set up and is a very neat and tidy design Yeah it looks simple that bar design, the release is the same as flexis but the fabric hinge is the other way around, (i.e. folds away from you instead of towards you). Is it single front line flag out in 4 line mode? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy-j Posted February 20, 2013 Report Share Posted February 20, 2013 try the mutiny bar comes with either a four or 5 line set up and is a very neat and tidy design I have a friend that rides mutiny and he says there are design flaws needing ironed out. Can't for the life of me remember what they were though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maro Posted February 20, 2013 Report Share Posted February 20, 2013 The depower ropes weren't lasting long, the solid chicken loop and very short and bendy/snappy donkey dick meant they could unhook at any time. These things have already or currently are being sorted I believe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TallPaul Posted February 20, 2013 Report Share Posted February 20, 2013 Just come off Mutiny (2011 bar). Without doubt the nicest bar I've used in terms of the grip, the suede type material is really nice. Found the bar diameter to be a little thin. Does wear the depower rope quite quickly. They upgraded the donkey dick and the new one was much better but still quite thin/flexible (though never came out despite this). Spinning mechanism worked well even when not cleaned out. Mine fifth to double front line safety worked well but not to everyones liking, big plus side to this system seemed to be the bar is still fairly close to you if you release. Not got loads of throw on the bar. Chicken loop release and reconstruction is simple. Have just moved to slingshot compstick 2012 and pretty pleased with that. Bar grip is tough & heavy duty and the bar is definately the heaviest I have used but is also reassuringly solid. Can't comment on wear and tear as not had it long enough but solid single front line safety that leaves the kite nicely nose down and completely killed. Safety release is good and reconstruction is ok (not the easiest with gloves on). Lines are excellent. Below the bar depower works well but takes a little getting used to. Loads of throw on the bar and stopper ball system works well without too much pressure to push it on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Afro1599968737 Posted February 21, 2013 Report Share Posted February 21, 2013 What I dont understand is why the QR seperates, I ride around without the donkey dick in. If I were to release I would loose the chicken loop.. Dumass design if you ask me... there have been a very few cases where after pulling the QR it hasnt fed round properly, some part of the end has snagged on the spreader hook and riders have been badly injured. i've never heard of it happening with the separating versions. and if you feed your leash through the CL before attaching it, then you still cant loose it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tjah1087 Posted February 21, 2013 Report Share Posted February 21, 2013 The depower ropes weren't lasting long, the solid chicken loop and very short and bendy/snappy donkey dick meant they could unhook at any time. These things have already or currently are being sorted I believe. Just want to say that the only 100% depower safety is to release the kite - even a kite flagged out on a single line can create a hefty pull in a squall, when caught in a wave or when tangled with a deathlooping kite. This is the reason why mutiny and flexi chicken loops release completely - it is the only guaranteed way to completely separate the kite from your harness... anything that leaves a 5th line attached to your chicken loop attached to your harness will never release under load (see above). The "trigger" systems like airush's can also jam in some harness hooks - again this isn't safe. These issues were present on first generation Mutiny bar, but they are all fixed on 2012 bar. They also moved from the flexi style 4 line flag out to the much preferred single front line flag out with the 2012 kites. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bartiebat1599968741 Posted February 21, 2013 Report Share Posted February 21, 2013 Yup, I've heard of plenty of people using that setup, and I've never heard of or thought up a problem with it. What's the set up on the new Proton? Rob H's broke at the apex of his jump breaking both his legs? Not sure what exactly failed on it, something to do with the chicken loop I believe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
si-fly Posted February 21, 2013 Report Share Posted February 21, 2013 Have used flexi and other double front safety systems for years with no problems, but a couple of weeks ago was out in 20kts on my 8.5 ion 2 and with no warning wind picked up to 45-50+ Hung on for 10-15 mins fully de-powered kite bucking like a good un Finally came ashore and was still being dragged on my ass up the beach on just the front lines! Luckily I just managed to keep control of the kite and re-leash to a ring I put on a single front and kill the kite with this, before I reached the dunes! Just bought 2 ozone bars off a mate with single safety through the bar, lesson learned! Si. PS. As a side note mate out at the same time on his 7m dropped his to a single front line no problem, BUT as he ran to grab it, it lifted off the beach through the window and some how the line wrapped round his hand and he supermaned into the dunes....nasty!! Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paulie_amoose Posted February 21, 2013 Report Share Posted February 21, 2013 there have been a very few cases where after pulling the QR it hasnt fed round properly, some part of the end has snagged on the spreader hook and riders have been badly injured. i've never heard of it happening with the separating versions. and if you feed your leash through the CL before attaching it, then you still cant loose it. I have released many times on my integrated QR and never had it catch, I can see that there is a small risk of it doing so though so fair point.. well made... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bash1599968729 Posted February 22, 2013 Report Share Posted February 22, 2013 the 4 line set up on the mutiny is a mini fifth, i rode with mini fifth, but in silly weather rig a 5 line set up.(1st gen bars) the 5 line bar is as you would expect, it has the stopper ball to prevent the bar disappearing to the kite, but lets be honest you probably wont get the bar back if you pull it onto the fifth so its a pack down and swim anyways. The early bars some of you have mentioned did have a weaker donkey dick but i don't normally have the donkey dick in but i know for most they do. this has however been sorted, I stick by it i think its one of he best bars on the market, and i know they have been approached by more than a few other manufacturers to have the bar so its not just impressing the riders! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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