mate im not sure the phantom is the ideal buggy engine, although it works a treat its by far the best kite out of all of them that u have listed and u can use it on the sea when u finally get into kitesurfing Im pretty sure that if u get a chance to have a go it will do all the convincing by its self!!! If you remember back, it might even be before your time up on the hill, SJ said he didnt like flyin with bars and that flexi's were the only way to go, he had one go on the phantom and look what happened Guerilla was born and well nuff said about badger......