Atom 07 v Waroo 07 Which is Safest?

[marypoppins]

Contemplating buying one of these (maybe 2) 9m and 12m. I know that that when you let go of the bar on the Atom all back line pressure is released and the bar goes about 6ft or so away for you then to retrieve. What happens on the Waroo? Does the sliding stopper allow the bar to go through it, or do you have to physically push the bar past, and then is the final position of the bar sufficient to suitably depower the kite and is it a total depower?

Any comments appreciated.

[si-fly]

When you say "let go the bar" do you mean still hooked in to the depower? ...or do you mean when unhooked riding?

 

When hooked in to the atom the bar only goes 2ft away (depends on chicken line length) and if using mini 5th and totally release safety it still only goes about 4ft on my setup and easy to pull back in.

 

Not sure about Waroo but the older versions did have long depower throws, hense the need for stoppers.

Si.

[KiteItRight]

Not the warroo because they use a Re ride system, asnd i think re ride sytems are suicidal. i would neve4r use one again. If you get a bar that flags and use it with the warroo then it wil be fine, and the kite itsself is pretty safe, just the control bar

[ouchmyankle]

The waroo bar does have a long throw but is easy to reach when the bar is let go to totally depower the kite. My only gripe with the bar is when the QR is used ive had to come in to reset as it is nearly impossible to reset while in the water and also on the 2 occations I have used it the QR requires a couple of good tugs to work.

[ouchmyankle]

I'm hoping the 08 bar will be better. Anyone know when it will be on sale.

[marypoppins]

Not the warroo because they use a Re ride system, asnd i think re ride sytems are suicidal. i would neve4r use one again. If you get a bar that flags and use it with the warroo then it wil be fine, and the kite itsself is pretty safe, just the control bar

 

 

Sounds dangerous. Could you explain please? Surely if you pull the primary release at the chicken loop you are still connected to the front lines and the bar slides up the centre rope as far as it can which sort of "flags out" the entire trailing edge of the kite? That is assuming that the bar is able to push past the stopper.

The centre rope on the 07 bar I saw yesterday seemed to be quite long (about 20 ins) and I would have thought this sufficient to release the back edge?

....I hope I am explaining this OK?

[KiteItRight]

Not the warroo because they use a Re ride system, asnd i think re ride sytems are suicidal. i would neve4r use one again. If you get a bar that flags and use it with the warroo then it wil be fine, and the kite itsself is pretty safe, just the control bar

 

 

 

The Problem with a Re ride system is that, unless the kite is completely flagged it still has power in it.

In high winds, Lets say a steering line snapped. Ok you pull the QR in the chicken loop which only gives you the extra foot of depower. Now that sounds a lot, but trust me its isn’t and you will be dragged downwind with the kite still looping... and no way of reaching the bar

 

Also, a scenario that actually happened me. Missed a trick and let go of the bar. As I came up from the water, the leader line ad wrapped around the bar causing the kite to loop slowly, I was not in control as I was connected only by my leash, so could not reach the bar.

 

This also happened to me at rhosngr, I was on a 1m very powered and the squall unexpectedly came through and the wind picked up to 50 or so. I couldn’t hold the kite on the ground so I pulled the QR, which only gave me that "extra depower" The kite was then dragging me up the beach by my leash.

Eventually the leash snapped and that’s what saved me

 

Now you could attach that leash to your oh **** handle, which would flag the kite, but that means the leash is in the way and you can spin the bar. The worst draw back to using the oh **** is that if u do pull the safety, the kite just loops and loops and loops on the one back line, so your relaunching hope goes out the window, meaning you’ll probably have to ditch and swim in.

 

I believe that when u pull that QR, that is the end, and the kite should lie dead on the water until you are ready to go again, Not still opened out with extra deposer.

 

A lot of the new kites to this and it are a fantastic system. The QR is on the one front line so it completely flags the kite, and also relaunches very easily after.

It also means it’s easier to self land the kite.

[sidmaniac]

The bar does not push past the stopper on the 07 Best bar. The stopper is just there to set the bar throw, if you want to.

 

If you want flag the kite out on the 07 Best bar, you need to leash to the OSH to flag out to a rear line The re-ride system can hardly be described as 'suicide' - sure its not the best system, buts it a convenient and tidy place to leash to. A flag out system on the front line would be a better setup- like the EH bar. Bring on the 08 Best bar.

 

IMHO the Atom ia probably a better system, but has its minus points too.

[TeddyP]

ive tried them both and i found that the waroo was slightly gruntier. when you let go of the bar for the atom it just flaps to the edge of the window and waits for you.

[marypoppins]

Teddy, do you mean that the Atom depowers more, and is therefore safer?

 

Kingralst, I really don't think I'm going to be kiting at your level but do take on board the points you make. If the centre ropes of the Waroo bar were made that little bit longer would this fix the problem?

I appreciate the idea of the control bars that just hold onto one of the front lines but is this not affected by the side of the wind window that the kite comes down and will this not leave the kite the wron way round for a relaunch, or is that me just being idealistic?

[KiteItRight]

Teddy, do you mean that the Atom depowers more, and is therefore safer?

 

Kingralst, I really don't think I'm going to be kiting at your level but do take on board the points you make. If the centre ropes of the Waroo bar were made that little bit longer would this fix the problem?

I appreciate the idea of the control bars that just hold onto one of the front lines but is this not affected by the side of the wind window that the kite comes down and will this not leave the kite the wron way round for a relaunch, or is that me just being idealistic?

 

 

Hey, level has nothng to do withit really Mary, it can happend to anyone. When this happend to me i had only had 6 months experience.

 

The longer chinken line wont really solve the problem. It wil b3e very inconveient.

The bar to look at is the Slingshot rev bar, of the EH bar, Many guys use the EH bar with the waroo which is much safer.

 

 

Lol i no what your trying to say with the wrong side of the window, but know it doesnt. I frind it very difficult to descbibr but watch this video. It show just how that sysetem works. Its so easy and simple and works like its shown every time.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OiKY8S9HGFs

[marypoppins]

Just watched the video and see what you mean- similar in many respects to the 5th line concept where you gradually feed the line back through to the kite.

What is the slingshot bar that is being used there- I see there are three kinds on the slingshot website?

[TeddyP]

actually, just seen your talkin about the 07 modle ive only tried the 08... but i dont think it would have changed to much

[KiteItRight]

Just watched the video and see what you mean- similar in many respects to the 5th line concept where you gradually feed the line back through to the kite.

What is the slingshot bar that is being used there- I see there are three kinds on the slingshot website?

 

 

 

its the bar for the slingshot rev

[stueyboy]

The 07 waroo can have the safety attached in two places. One on the chicken loop, so that when you pull the safety, it works as described. Usually used when people want to do rotations and not have the safety tangle round the outside lines. The other attachment is on the OSR tabs on the outside line so when pulled, the kite does flag on one back line. Not ideal to re-ride but safer.

[kite geek]

The 08 waroo bar is really safe. I have never felt that its not safe when I fly my roo's. The waroo bar is nicer because it doesnt dig into your hands when unhooked.

 

PM me if you would like to see my review on the 08 waroo.

 

James

[Redmini]

"which is safest"

 

dont think this sport is for you

[sidmaniac]

Thats the point redmini, as far as i am aware kitesufing is still considered as an extreme sport.

 

I agree that the reride system on the Best 07 may not be the 'safest system' when you use it outside the recomended wind range- like releasing to the reride as a self land option in 50 mph winds, FFS WOT DO YOU EXPECT! This example has been rolled out time and agian on this forum, and its user error, not the gear.

 

The waroo has been such a success because it like other kites of a similar ilk it is so user friendly. Some folks will start to place over reliance on the design rather than good judgement. Get real, the human factor is the **** up not the kite or bar in the majority of injuries or fatalities in all kitesurfing incidents. That goes for all sports especially watersports where there are inherent dangers, its the human factor and not taking the appropriate precautions in the first place and then reacting incorrectly that gets you dead.

[marypoppins]

"which is safest"

 

dont think this sport is for you

 

So, are you the kind of person who just dives into something without weighing up the pros and cons of different types of equipment?

 

Different people have different goals. I would like to think that you can enjoy yourself without taking unnecessary risks.

[sidmaniac]

There is a lot of discussion about the best 07 bar here-

 

http://forum.bestkiteboarding.com/viewtopic.php?t=6443&start=75&sid=e23e2e7ac52f773e25a9b9667b4cb84d

 

The new '08 bar should be a significant improvement and address those concerns.

 

There is no such thing as an idiot proof safety system, It's the human error factor that the problem.

 

I have found the '07 bar perfectly good, but it could be a lot better with a few simple mods.