flexifoil ion 5 5 line setup

[Twisted]

Ok had my ion 5 12.5 for several months now, it was an ex demo from flexifoil Europe, and the 5th line kit provided was from an ion 4.

After tuning it up and getting a feel for it in 4 line mode I decided it was time to try it in 5 line mode (i much preferred my ion 2 in 5 line)

On first flight I found it was way under powered and had to put a knot in the back line attachment about 500mm in, in 4 line mode I flew on knot about 300mm in. Even on the new knot it still felt underpowered and fairly unstable but could feel its potential as it had much more power through the turns.

The only two things I could think of are:

1) the ion 4 1/2 attachments are shorter than the ion 5's ( the ones supplied are shorter than my ion 2's)

 

2) I have read somewhere that the 2010/2011 all in one bar has a longer throw i,e more depower, im using my ion 3 bar and that due to shorter throw its over depowered.

 

Any ideas?

Does anyone know if there is a difference in length between ion 4 and 5 1/2 attachment lines? Or could someone measure there ion 5 5 line 1/2 attachment line?

 

Just wanted to find out the cause behind this.

[Maro]

The throw is adjustable by moving the depower rope knot and the bar hasn't changed since 2009/ion3.

 

Dunno about the other issues.

[Will Holt]

I wish flexifoil would sort their bloody pigtails out. The ions have been a bitch to tune since their birth. In terms of tuning the bar throw has stayed pretty much the same all your lines should be the same length when fully trimmed out. Its then just a question of tuning up at the pigtail end. I fly on the five line setup and foudn that the kite flys really loose on the back lines if you dont trim it and generates no power. Trial and error is only way until the kite just oversheets when you fully pull the bar in. 500mm is half a meter are you sure you did it that much because that is a huge ammount to trim by. If you mean 50mm (5cm) that sounds similar to what im flying on. Flew my brothers rebel at the weekend and was amazed how easy it was to set up, no messing about with knots or pigtails flew on the default lengths and it just worked. Flexi should probably take a leaf out of Norths book.

[Twisted]

Hey will, sorry been away, all lines are equal when fully powered, It was the kiteworld review that mentioned a longer throw. I know you can adjust it anyway but was just something I remembered and would half explain it. Yep all my ions have needed rear lines tightening a fair bit, flexi said its down to personal preference, but I have never been able to fly any ion on the last knot(furthest from kite) and yes its roughly half a meter which is why I think there is something to explain this. The fact that it is more servere in 5 line mode would suggest it has to be the front line (1/2) attachment points as this is the only thing that has changed from 4 line to 5 line setup, I was running the 5th line loose with bridal originally as I fly inland and it reduces wear from solo launching. I think I have an ion 3 5 line set somewhere so might try it on those as they are definitely longer and should resolve the issue, it just seems strange!

Edited August 19, 2011 by Twisted

[br3n]

All my ion4's are 4 line and default settings - I always just fly on the knot closest to the kite and try and avoid using adjusting the trim on the bar unless its for walking down to the beach (they fly crap otherwise).

[Will Holt]

When you took the bridle off to change up from four line to fifth line did you put the pigtail things on the frontline or are you attaching the lines straight to the kite? The extension thing is roughly half a metre

[Will Holt]

Ok just checked the ion5 manual and it appears they just take the bridle off and attach the toggles and then attach the centre lines straight to these. Every previous ion has had a roughly 50cm pigtail line that goes from these toggles to the centre lines for five line mode to give the correct angle of attack. I cannot see any reason why you would not need these on the ion 5 as the attachment point positions are almost identical! If your kite is ex-demo they may have lost or not included them but you could probably nab them off one of your other ions and see if thats what it is.

[Twisted]

Ok just measured the 1/2 lines (frontline pigtail extenders) from an ion 3 14.5 which measure up at 126cm and the one on my ion 5 12.5 which are from an ion of unknown size are only 88cm! This has to be the key. I'm suprised the ion 4's are soo much shorter as the kites have similar profiles?! I assume that all kite sizes of the same year would have the same length attachment lines.

Any ideas?

Edited August 26, 2011 by Twisted

[Twisted]

Ok just measured the 1/2 lines (frontline pigtail extenders) from an ion 3 14.5 which measure up at 162cm and the one on my ion 5 12.5 which are from an ion of unknown size are only 88cm! This has to be the key. I'm suprised the ion 4's are soo much shorter as the kites have similar profiles?! I assume that all kite sizes of the same year would have the same length attachment lines.

Any ideas?

[Will Holt]

I think this is your problem. I wonder if when they sold you the kite ex demo they just chucked in a pair from a different kite as they had lost the originals hence the ones you have are the wrong lengths. Im not sure about the lengths but i imagine that rather than all the lengths being the same for all sizes each year, the lengths are the same for all the kites of the same size i.e. to compensate for scaling up and scaling down and hence difference in the attachment points (don't quote me on that though). Id give Flexi a call or at least and email and find out how long they are supposed to be. Definitely worth doing as the performance gain is significant especially at the low end where the ion's are traditionally awful (just my opinion)!

[pieman1599968788]

I got a 5th line kite for the ion 2 for sale so worth a punt for a tenner?

[Will Holt]

The 1/2 lines dont come with the fifth line kit, they come with the kite!

[Twisted]

Ok, so I got a reply from flexi and 1/2 lines are correct length, said maybe I set something up incorrectly, but in my mind there is nothing to set up incorrectly, lines are equal lengths when fully powered so maybe someone changed the rear pig tails I guess.

Ion 4's and 5's have same 1/2 lines but each kite size is different.

Apparently flexi are looking at ditching 5th line setups in future due to conern of cutting kite in half!!! Oh and I guess mainly due to the fact they have to pay north each time they sell a 5th line. If they do ditch them, they need a better system than current mini 5th.

Personally I use 5th line mainly due to solo launching on land, but do like the more direct feel.

[Twisted]

Ok, so I got a reply from flexi and 1/2 lines are correct length, said maybe I set something up incorrectly, but in my mind there is nothing to set up incorrectly, lines are equal lengths when fully powered so maybe someone changed the rear pig tails I guess.

Ion 4's and 5's have same 1/2 lines but each kite size is different.

Apparently flexi are looking at ditching 5th line setups in future due to conern of cutting kite in half!!! Oh and I guess mainly due to the fact they have to pay north each time they sell a 5th line. If they do ditch them, they need a better system than current mini 5th.

Personally I use 5th line mainly due to solo launching on land, but do like the more direct feel.

[Will Holt]

It might be your rear pigtails but still 50 cm is a huge ammount. The fifth line always carries the risk of cutting any kite in half. I flew the 4 line twice, changed to the fifth and never looked back, in my opinion it feels a lot better to fly. Never bailed onto the 'mini fifth' but they get a lot of bad press. I will probably be at Camber over the weekend so if your there ill happily take a look but doubt ill be able to help as im out of ideas. Cant imagine your setting it up wrong if you have been flying II's and III's! Ill probably have my Ion III 12.5 down if you want to have a look at lengths.